Hold 4 and 5

[Aslyn Denethorn]

Hey people,

So, now I've had chance to test out Hold 3, I'm naturally thinking whether it's worth (later on) taking Hold 4 and 5, since I use Hold purely for the telekinetic motion rather than to cause damage. Obviously in some FF spars, Hold 4 and 5 are useful if you just want to damage your opponent, but in RP terms, it's a pretty un-Jedi-like thing to use telekinesis to throttle someone.

As such, I was wondering what people thought about reworking Hold 4 and 5 to do one of the following:

1) Extending the range of the grip
2) Increasing the duration of the grip (with an exponential drain on FP)
3) Extending the reach of the grip (so in a standing position, you'd be able to move a person further with Hold 4 than with Hold 5)

Noting that people may still want damage attached to the higher levels (which, I admit, always struck me as odd - I can move something that weighs tons but can't crush someone's throat without advancing my ability?), but under those circumstances, is it possible to have a power alternative? So Hold 4(1) would cause damage but 4(2) would have the other benefits of 4 (if the above were implemented), but lack the damage?

Just a thought for those of us that like our Telekinesis

[Naj]

I think it would be better indeed, when a read the hold 4 and 5 after seeing it in action i also think there should atleast be a mode without damage. It would be a serious nice rp element

[Yrael Grekkis]

it's a pretty un-Jedi-like thing to use telekinesis to throttle someone.

It's not un-Jedi like. Whatever comes natural or to disarm an opponent with blunt force rather than a saber attack.

[Nira'kalen'nuruodo]

There are far better ways of disarming someone than telekinetically crushing their windpipe. Pulling their weapon out of their hands works just as well, without resorting to phyiscally harming them.

Also, I wholeheartedly support Aslyn's proposal.

[Yrael Grekkis]

True. But a click flip of your hand and their disarmed. Faster, easer, they'll live.

[Aknaross Myotis]

I've discussed and keep on talk to Soh about improvements on FORCE HOLD.

The ideas on are surrounding these:

Force Hold LVL 4 - Extending range for Hold; lift multiple targets (two I believe);
!Force Grip= hold Hold key+press Attack Button and it will cause damage!

(Works like on TFU: you lift a target and press other button to start damaging the target. The code has been talked, I believe Soh is pretty much getting into how to do it)

Force Hold LVL 5 - Extending more range for Hold (perhaps); lift multiple targets (three this time I believe);
!Force Crush= hold Hold key+press Attack Button and will cause greater damage!

At the time RP Mod 0.5.0 be released, I believe several features from the nearly released OJP E 1.3 will be included aswell; on it includes many features such as damaging at shock (damage someone against someone/thing else (can't say yet for walls and doors), that will give holds another perspective for its use. Once OJP is an open source mod and some feats are already in use on RP Mod, we don't need to worry about.

[Gabe Alkorda]

IMO, Hold3 is all you could ever want/need, although an increased range and what-not would be nice. I'm against getting rid of the lvl4/5 grip stuff (even though i stick with 3 because i dont wanna inflict pain).

BUT

Aknaross's proposal is excellent, and if it can be implemented, you'll get a nice big woot from me.

[Ze'eal]

I've discussed and keep on talk to Soh about improvements on FORCE HOLD.

The ideas on are surrounding these:

Force Hold LVL 4 - Extending range for Hold; lift multiple targets (two I believe);
!Force Grip= hold Hold key+press Attack Button and it will cause damage!

(Works like on TFU: you lift a target and press other button to start damaging the target. The code has been talked, I believe Soh is pretty much getting into how to do it)

Force Hold LVL 5 - Extending more range for Hold (perhaps); lift multiple targets (three this time I believe);
!Force Crush= hold Hold key+press Attack Button and will cause greater damage!

At the time RP Mod 0.5.0 be released, I believe several features from the nearly released OJP E 1.3 will be included aswell; on it includes many features such as damaging at shock (damage someone against someone/thing else (can't say yet for walls and doors), that will give holds another perspective for its use. Once OJP is an open source mod and some feats are already in use on RP Mod, we don't need to worry about.

I wholeheartedly support every notion within this post.

[Aslyn Denethorn]

Yeah, Aknaross' idea would be absolutely perfect.

[Naj]

That would be some serious nice improvements I like them!

[Jared]

From a game mechanic stand point, level 4 + 5 hold offer tactical advantages for force users. In a fight to the death (e.g. on a mission) 'Crush/Grip' is a totally valid ability to have in your arsenal. Mace Windu used it on Greivous, Kyle Katarn had it throughout his career etc.

Should it be used peer to peer in spars? Probably not. Should it be removed because the idea of a 'Jedi' knowing something Darth Vader knows is upsetting? No.

If you want to RP that Hold 4 + 5 damage you because of velocity, go right ahead but there isn't an implicit implication that you are crushing your foes windpipe. I've always RP'd that I'm using it to constrict their breathing, rendering them unconscious or winded - much like a Police Officer using a tazer or tear gas.

I only use Hold 4+5 against: Npc's, My own Padawans, Those who have discussed my RP application of it with me IC and OOC and have given consent (e.g. Aayla, Syrena etc.)

Aknaross' suggestion is great and if it CAN be implemented without too much hassle or glitches, all the better.

Remember: RPmod isn't just for Jedi in JEDI.

If the power is 'bad' think twice about using it or stick with your HC approved story for its use, but while Guardians continue to have up to three times my total HP/SP, I'll continue to leech away at that bonus.

It's not un-Jedi like. Whatever comes natural or to disarm an opponent with blunt force rather than a saber attack.

It IS un-Jedi like, but that doesn't mean it can't have an application in the RP at a certain level of experience.

Finally: Aslyn, there are some 'tricks' to using level 3 hold to make it more awesome. We will talk about it server side. I personally use an exec to switch between 'offensive' and 'controlled' abilities.

[Vantus]

Should it be removed because the idea of a 'Jedi' knowing something Darth Vader knows is upsetting? No.

If the power is 'bad' think twice about using it or stick with your HC approved story for its use.

I have to admit i'm with Jared on this one.
The exec suggestion sounds like a fine idea also.


As for the whole good/bad powers part:

Remember, no force power is inherently Good or Evil... it's how you use them.

[Cyril Feraan]

However let's not forget the Potentium theory is canonically a "heresy" and Katarn followed the Potentium.

[Vantus]

However let's not forget the Potentium theory is canonically a "heresy" and Katarn followed the Potentium.

I <3 Potentium

[Aslyn Denethorn]

However let's not forget the Potentium theory is canonically a "heresy" and Katarn followed the Potentium.

Pretty certain that's also a general NJO/Unifying Force philosophy, too