Firearm Damage Bolstering (Idea rehash)

[Oberon]

Jedi, in order to protect others, often find themselves on the frontline in a battle against those who would harm other beings. Most commonly favored to intimidate or sometimes wound other beings would be the blaster.

At the current damage scale and enhanced HP pools Jedi type characters enjoy, blasters are hardly the threat they should be. Now this may not necessarily an RPmod feature (the damage scale can be upped in the server settings) unless you would want to implement a system like below,

viewtopic.php?t=7143

Perhaps to account for shifts between simulation and real Galaxy firearms. Or training settings like Amoné ICly rigged into her handgun.

I personally am a fan of harder videogames because they inspire a little more tactical reasoning a less success is had by leaping before you look.

"Guns are dangerous things, and I think adding the extra damage would put a little bit of fear, caution, and realism on both sides of an encounter." -Sared

Putting power back in the "common man" will revitalize the interest of taking cover, getting the drop on someone, picking your fight, or attending defensive tactic courses and Knight may be holding. Because as of right now, "Oh I can't seem to block blaster bolts? No big deal, dawg (not addressing Delmi) each shot only does 10 points of damage anyhow." (And when you spawn, You ALWAYS get shields )

[Nastajja Arren]

This idea will only work if the people using the blasters can learn to use them realistically, and not spam fire them at people they saw because their camera was pointed behind them..

[Kih Bu]

Implement an effective, realistic deflection system to JKA, then I'll seriously consider supporting this. As it stands, regardless of your deflection level, there is not a whole lot of hope that you'll deflect an incoming blaster bolt from a single blaster every time. All I have to do is aim a little below the hilt and the Jedi is toast.

[Amoné Fayden]

Both my concerns have been said above:

1) Players do like taking the oportunity to make sure they "win" against Jedi in simulations and missions. Making blasters more dangerous just further empowers them.

2) Blasters do little damage per shot unrealistically to compensate for how easy it is to hit a Jedi, even with Lightsaber Defense 5.


I like the concept, I just wonder if JEDI is the right place for it or not.
If JEDI were an FFA clan where Killing your oponent was the goal, for scoring, then I'd say sure.

However, JEDI is a "cinematic" experience and more often than not we don't want to kill off our characters.

[Zuri Lyn]

Personally, I'm really for increasing realism during missions.

From what people have said, it seems that up to now, soldiers in missions would :
_Unrealistically spam bolts
_Unrealistically dodge lightsaber swings
And as for jedi, they would take an unrealistic number of bolts without even being downed.

It's been mentioned in the last topic about this, and Amoné also mentioned it: the problem generally comes from the Players not rp'ing realistically. But I mean, really, what's the difficulty in teaching them not to spam shots? There really is none !

I agree that JEDI is a cinematic experience - on the main server that is.
During missions, you are being tested on what you've learnt and are putting into action what you've learnt. It thus needs to be even MORE realistic while on missions then back at the temple, where you could always be healed when hurt.

Kih said that deflection was unrealist as it was, because players can shoot you in the feet and you won't deflect. This problem is not a problem any more as soon as you simply instruct the players to NOT shoot below the waist. *hop*, no problemo.


Now then, I'm guessing a lot of you don't think it's so easy to tell someone what to not do during missions. Well, it is. Explanation : Everyone of us is a JEDI member. We are all sensible (at least we hope so :p) and know how to listen. If at a start of a mission, the organiser simply gives these reminders :
_Do not spam shots. That means, do not shoot more then once per second.
_Do not shoot below the waist.
_Do no run towards the enemy unless told by a superior.
With these VERY simple instructions, about all the problems have been solved. Oh wait, one of the problems hasn't been solved. Which?
Well, jedi still take an unrealistic number of shots before dying. The solution has been presented to you by Oberon recently, and Sared Kilvan not so recently : Up the Damage done by blasters.

I prefer Sared's solution, with a setting to modify the damage done by blasters.


It probably still is an incomplete solution, but with this, jedi certainly would learn to be careful. Players too.

[Amoné Fayden]

I love your suggestions on fixing the players Zuri but I've rattled off the "Do's and Don't" of realistic battles until was blue-in-the-face many times.

The reality of it is, mission holders/directors can't have their eyes in every direction at once and some people just get away with backpeddle-spraying whilst taking several slashes to the face from a Lightsaber.

A Jedi stopping to open their chat bubble and type ::Slashes the bunny hopping Merc across his arm:: often just allows the merc time to get some distance and then chat-snipe them the second they drop bubble. Or the merc simply doesn't read the chat in the heat of the battle and keeps going.

But I'm definitely on board with "changing players" rather than increasing the power of blasters, thus making it even easier for them to "pwn Jedi".
(Possibly through penalty of being forced to Spec or exluded from further missions.)

In my opinion, this sort of suggestion would be welcomed but not before JEDI changes (or enforces change in) the way missions are ran and "gunner" roles are regulated.

[Tergos Zemnos]

Well perhaps we could add the slug (Bullets) to RPmod. I'm sure it's achievable, considering it's been added to MB2. Maybe the slugs could pose possible extra damage that those are seeking for (realism). Though I'd have to agree with most of what Amoné has to say. I don't agree that ten people shoot at a Jedi rapidly, and we're able to deflect them all. It's practically not possible for any Jedi to do so, their movements aren't that quick enough. Unless you're possibly experienced in augmenting your speed of your arms (rare). Though I definitely see what Oberon is trying to get at, we definitely do need a more realistic system.

[Delmi N'jork]

I'd fully support this but:

• Bad deflection/reflection is bad.
• People love to go into ffa mode and spam alt fires.
• In missions, etc, people like to prove that they can hit Jedi and win instead of going along with the RP.
• Already pretty unrealistic combat in terms of Jedi vs gun wielder.

So, change the other stuff first and then worry about the damage of blaster shots.

[Simus Cnydaria]

I believe as part of the last update to rpmod we scaled down everyone's health with the purpose of making weapons (lightsabers as well as blasters) more dangerous. We also scaled back force pools so powers couldn't be spammed as easily. I haven't been in a mission since we've done that so I don't know if it's effective or not, but the only realistic way I see of implementing your idea to make weapons more dangerous is to scale back health again.

[Oberon]

I see of implementing your idea to make weapons more dangerous is to scale back health again.

Or just up the damage on guns...

I don't know where everyone's seeing all these players who are playing to win and not playing just to be the dumb OPFOR as intended. AFAIK most people are aware of the hallmark rule of mission acting, "Your time will come. In the meantime you're here to serve their RP." Your job is to train them, not grind them into a pulp.

Maybe if we quit allowing Hopefuls to participate in important Galaxy events this wouldn't be such a popular sentiment. You know something's wrong when you connect to a server and some little four year old is merc'd with more guns that the little kid weighs.

If any actual JEDI member is here to "totes win the game bro" they need a megaslap at this point.

All that to say. Until some RPmod modifier is made, the simple server settings can easily be edited and are more easily given a trial period that say, Force regens, since it's more easily reversed. Right in the server.cfg. We could give it a shot, or more, to see how good/bad it actually is.

[Amoné Fayden]

Oberon, you need to attend more sims and missions, then you'll understand.
I'd love to name names for the sake of giving you examples, but I don't want to go down that route.

• Using 3rd person camera to see around walls for IC advantages.
• Spraying alt fire indiscriminately.
• Throwing 10+ Thermal Dets one after the other to coax out players who are trying to hide tactfully or to get a moment to... you know, RP.
• Chat bubble sniping with the Disruptor, waiting for you to stop typing so they can 1-hit you.
• Bunny hopping.
• Continuing to fire at you and running even after they are slashed multiple times.
• Turning and firing at you when you sneak up behind them and open your chat to type out a KO action.
• Here's one of my biggest gripes... Knights and Masters who use their Jedi Account for playing Mercs! (The benefit of extra HP+Shields plus Sense and Jump.)

Guaranteed you'll see at least three of those in any given "regular" Mission or Simulation.

I'd very much like to do my own part to change the above list but well... Padawan and all that.


Fix the issues above and I'll definitely consider the suggestion! ::Thumbs up::

[Oberon]

Alright, let's stappit!

I remember we instigated a vitals rule during that one mission where Amoné played the Firrerreo Doctor. Twas a fun idea but too bad there were no shootouts.

Seb did get crushed in an elevator though.

*As always the easiest change we can make is one that doesn't touch server files. And hey if more people thought it was fun to act on how many times you were hit or where rather than what your HP count is at. Or being forced to sit out because that meany Jedi knocked you down or killed you (depending on account)

But I feel so out of place discussing something like this on a thread that's supposed to be RPmod related. Yet it's good to talk about. Too bad there's no RP Suggestions thread to discuss in, yea?

[Amoné Fayden]

Too bad there's no RP Suggestions thread to discuss in, yea?

Ya Agreed!

Though in this case, the RPMod Suggestion in your original post isn't sitting right with me because I think it will contribute to and encourage poor quality RP in an area that is already suffering heavily from it.

That's enough for me to say No.

But as the usual disclaimer goes: This is just my own opinion!

[Kenta]

Until I can have full trust in everyone turning off quake mode when things get hot in a mission, I'm not for this, still have nightmares about the Mon Cal series of missions during the war.

[Amoné Fayden]

Welcome to the future Kenta.

Glad to have you!